A foul tip went directly back to the catcher and was lodged between the catcher's legs.

The catcher then reached down and picked up the ball without it touching the ground.

As an umpire, I think this is a legal catch. I'm looking for other opinions.

Thanks

Steve Ward

Wardo; The answer depends on what sport/association you are playing. MLB changed its rule in 2020. In the situation you described, it would not have been a legal catch prior to 2020. Now, it is a legal catch in the big leagues. I am not sure whether youth baseball rules changed after MLB changed its rule. In USA Softball play, the older rule remains in place. Your play would not be considered a catch. In SSUSA play, a foul tip is a dead ball. (If the batter has used his/her waste foul, or courtesy foul, the batter is out whether the foul tip is caught or not. If the fouled ball goes higher than the batter’s head, it can be caught for an out.)

Donna McGuire,

USA took out the phrase "that it must go above a catchers head to be considered a foul ball". The new terminology that was changed in like 2014(or so) states that as long as there is a discernable change of direction it's considered a foul ball and a legal catch for an out. It's really up to the umpire in what his opinion of "discernable" change of direction actually is. Seeing at most umpires stand between the batter and catcher it's hard to determine if it changes direction or not.

John028: USA (ASA) changed its foul tip rule in 2008, I believe. My earlier post said that in SSUSA play, a foul tip is a dead ball. If the batter has used his/her waste foul, or courtesy foul, the batter is out whether the foul tip is caught or not. If the fouled ball goes higher than the batter’s head in SSUSA PLAY, then it can be caught for an out.

SSUSA: foul tip above the batters head that’s caught by catcher—OUT
foul tip below batters head that’s caught is a foul ball (not an out) unless it’s a third strike foul, then it’s an out.
USSSA, NSA, ONE NATION( (young man ball) any foul tip caught whether it’s above or below the head—OUT

Umpires need better teaching. This happened in a winners bracket game this past weekend. The team this happened to ended up 2-1 count tip right back into the catchers chest and he cupped it against his chest with the glove and the ump called him out for the 3rd out. Bases were loaded down 1 run in the bottom of the open inning and the game ended like that. Neither captain nor the umpire knew the correct call and the game ended that way. I was right behind the fence when it happened and told the ump it was the wrong call that this discussion just took place on this page and he was mistaken.. I was greeted with I'm a trained ump in SSUSA, USSSA and ASA/USA and I know the rules. I asked him to confer with the director and was told he wouldn't.. The same ump allowed the game winning run to run through the batters box and step partially on the pitching matt to end the game while staring down and watching him do it. He said running through the box is allowed and that's not a rule, to which other other manager told him was a rule and he said well I didn't see him do it so it's not a valid argument. The manager said well what were you staring at you were standing on the 1B side of the plate staring down at it and as soon as he touched the matt you called ball game? He had no answer and walked away from him.
There was another play where the ball was popped up behind the 1B and the batter fell coming out of the box and was a slow runner to begin with. The ball landed about 15' out in the grass and the 2B had time to get to the ball and throw it to the 1B. The throw was rushed and thrown low and between the 1B bag and the dugout. The 1B scrambled to get the ball and fell down to his knees to pick it up. From foul territory he picked up the ball and tagged the orange base then the white base because he wasn't sure of the rule about touching the base. The batter then ran through the base and touched the orange base. The ump called the batter safe because he said the 1B touched the orange bag prior to touching the white bag.

There was also a big difference of opinion on what the ruling was pertaining to being in front of the plate when making contact with the ball. It was pretty much split down the middle on whether or not umps believed there was a rule about both feet being in front of the plate during contact. Our first game was our opponents second game and he asked the question at the coin flip meeting. He told the ump the last ump had called several batters out for being in front of the plate with both feet and wanted to know ahead of time if they were going to enforce that rule or not. The umps answer was seeing that that isn't a SSUSA rule he would not be calling batters out. 2 other umps said they would enforce the rules and the other I asked after that game said he wouldn't be enforcing it because A) it wasn't a rule and B) because there is no way for an ump to watch a batter feet at contact.

I really wish umpires would realize we pay a whole lot of money to play in these tourneys and we know things like pitch heights are subjective and up to umpires discreption but knowing the rules isn't optional. Either know the rules of the association your umping or don't do it, youre getting paid for this.

JohnO28, I agree wholeheartedly! You illustrate one of the issues that certain areas have with umpires they use for senior softball. Sometimes you get umps who may be proficient in USA, NSA, USSSA or One Nation but not so much with senior ball. I would hope that someone who is contracted to do a senior tournament that doesn’t know the rules would do due diligence to study the rules beforehand. I don’t think a crash course on senior rules 15 minutes before game time is going to cut it.
Those calls and non-calls you illustrate, wow!!