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Discussion: softballs that are kept in a cooler

Posted Discussion
Aug. 30, 2023
Oldballs
Men's 60
32 posts
softballs that are kept in a cooler
what is the rule about a team throwing in a softball that has been kept in a cooler filled with ice. when thrown in to a game with temps in the middle 90's the ball was sweating worse than me. umpire just took ball out of play.
Aug. 30, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
Rulebook 3.4(6) PENALTY FOR USING AN ALTERED BAT OR SOFTBALL

C. Penalty for use of an altered softball: If a softball is suspected of being altered to enhance performance, a tournament official will determine if the softball is allowed to be used. If the softball is found to be altered, the following penalties shall be imposed:
1. First offense in tournament: Game forfeiture by the offending team;
2. Second offense in tournament: Game forfeiture by the offending team, team ejection from the tournament and further disciplinary action review for potential team and/or manager suspension, at the discretion of SSUSA.
NOTE: An altered softball is deemed to be in play as soon as the offensive team provides it to the umpire or opponent.

Aug. 31, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
1tufout: which balls will we be using? Baden Fire 44/375? Thank you
__________

You were off topic in the other thread, so I dragged your post over here to the "softball department" ... YES, we will be using ONLY the Baden Fire 44/375 softball we have used all year ... Good luck!

Sept. 6, 2023
1tufout
Men's 50
8 posts
Ok, and thank you Dave
Sept. 6, 2023
HAT MAN
Men's 50
227 posts
Dave
Are teams allowed to buy the baden 44/375 from the internet?
Or are we only allowed to use the ones ssusa sells?

Vinny
Sept. 6, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
Vinny ... YES, so long as they are identical to the ones we will have onsite ... Identical means the SAME model number, 44/375 cor and compression ratings, product ID number (if applicable), SSUSA logo on the ball and same color stitching ... The burden of compliance with our provided softballs (and therefore, eligibility for use) rests solely with the team ... Good luck!
Sept. 6, 2023
HAT MAN
Men's 50
227 posts
Thanks Dave
So it must have a ssusa stamp on the ball or it can't be used. Got it

Vinny
Sept. 6, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
I'm presuming that the logo presence would be a component of "identical" ... It's worth a call to BADEN to be sure ... Good luck and I'll see you there ... It's been too long! ...
Sept. 10, 2023
Full Count
54 posts
Just to confirm. The same senior softball Baden Fire is available with out SSUSA stamp. It is only up to Baden to confirm we can use the same ball with out the stamp ?
Thank you.
Sept. 11, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
Full Count ... NO, that's NOT what my posts said OR intended to convey ... Our suggestion was, and remains, to call BADEN and inquire if their retail version includes the SSUSA logo ... They have NO authority to "confirm" anything other than that ... "Identical" is a fairly easily understood concept and the presence of the SSUSA logo is a component of that term ... If you desire to bring softballs that are not "identical", your team assumes the non-appealable risk of whether or not they will be allowed for use ...

Historical NOTE Ten or so years ago, there was an annoying and completely unnecessary time-wasting exercise at B.L.D. over multiple, repetitive protests by one team that another team was using "different" STOTE/Trump "ROCK" balls because they had a different color stitching ... It was a pure 50/50% non-meritorious argument, and whether or not the balls were identical performance-wise (the real issue) was never determined ... We're going to attempt to avoid a repeat of that exercise ... Thanks and Good Luck!

Sept. 11, 2023
softball4b
Men's 70
1213 posts
FYI. I purchased baden balls from SSUSA and they do not have the SSUSA stamp. I did receive an email from
Amal Oraikat
To: softball4b@aol.com
Hello,

Thank you for purchasing the Baden Fire Senior Ball (.44 Cor 375 PSI) from SSUSA

These are the official balls for SSUSA and will be used at Worlds.

I was told I will be able to use these balls at world and have email printed for verification.
Sept. 13, 2023
curveball
Men's 65
704 posts
Just to convey a "Paul Harvey" moment, the rest of the story. I was the sponsor and a player on the team Dave feels annoyed and wasted time protesting the performance of various balls at the Worlds. This was not about what color the stitching was, is was about performance. Followed advise from the No. Cal office and sent actual game ball samplers to The Sports Science Laboratory at Washington State University in Pullman Washington, the choice of testing for that time, maybe even still used today by SSUSA. They confirmed that the "burglar ball" which was the ball we were complaining about, was in fact higher compression and was in fact a "hotter" ball than the X Rock without the "burglar" stamp that we were issued at check-in. Your 50-50% non-meritorious argument is wrong. WSU testing confirmed they were not of identical performance.
We had 3 balls tested, a new X Rock, a game used X Rock, and our competitors game used X Rock with the "buglar" stamp.
Sept. 13, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
curveball ... Thanks for proving my point! ... That entire exercise WAS non-meritorious AND complete waste of time because: THE TEAMS SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN ALLOWED TO BRING & PUT A BALL IN PLAY THAT WAS NOT "IDENTICAL" ... If they're identical, then there's no reason for concern ... It's a nice "Paul Harvey rest-of-the-story" moment to learn a decade later that there in fact WAS a test-lab confirmed difference, but I stand by my (eventually overruled by a higher authority) position as the on-site Director that day ... At the time, you and I and everyone else had no clue whether or not they were identical in performance ... Although I was instructed to allow the balls to be used, I wasn't wrong ... Hopefully we don't see a not-so-instant replay ...

Sept. 13, 2023
tg69
390 posts
DD. Back to the original post. Balls kept in a cooler. What is the difference in putting a ball in the cooler and putting a bat in a bat warmer? Is that considered altering a bat?
Sept. 13, 2023
DaveDowell
Men's 70
4194 posts
The "ball in a cooler" cheat alters the technical performance of that ball and is, therefore, not allowed ... In our view, the "bat in a warmer" doesn't alter the bat's technical performance specifications, but rather only makes it less likely to break in cold(er) temperatures ... Players may use passive bat warmers only ...
Sept. 17, 2023
Asylum
1 posts
Good Evening, I have the same question as "softball4b" are we allowed to use the Baiden Fires that were purchased during the year at SSUSA events without the stamp? Or are we going to be allowed to exchange the unused, unmarked balls for ones with the new SSUSA stamp?
Thank you.
Sept. 17, 2023
BANDITOS180
Men's 55
33 posts
Asylum, I have the same question. I have about 10 of the Baden that just say Seniors in the circle and the new ones provided at worlds have the SSUSA logo so can we swap these with SSUSA for future tourney use or are we just out of luck? $40 for 6 balls is not cheap and these have been purchased throughout the year so we should be able to swap
Sept. 18, 2023
SSUSA Staff
3386 posts
The ONLY allowed softballs for play at the World Championships are the BADEN FIRE ball ... The balls MUST HAVE the SSUSA Logo on them ... If you acquired the BADEN ball WITHOUT the SSUSA Logo, we will trade you authorized softballs for the ones you brought to Las Vegas, so long as they are in wrappers and unmarked ... Good luck!
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