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Discussion: No tag call

Posted Discussion
July 25
Bigtimer40

16 posts
The question I have is, when a runner is between bases the fielder has ball in hand, but tags with glove and throws the ball to another base behind the runner to attempt a DP as umpires is up to us to vocalize "No Tag"? I had this happen in a league last night, I made no Audible call but the runner vacated the field. I then called time and had him out for abandonment. Explained to the team that I never made an out call and unless he reached the next base, I could not call him safe at the time either. I put the blame on the 3rd base coach for not paying closer attention.
July 25
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
1438 posts
It would probably depend a little bit, but I probably would do not more than signal safe. If he walks in the dugout, I would probably only signal the out and not verbalize. Just because they are not paying attention, there is no reason to get yourself in more trouble because of it. If they make themselves out, then it is unfortunately on them. I definitely would not call time until after I had the out in the dugout. We definitely aren’t there to provide clues, but not calling time should be more than enough.

Just one woman’s opinion.
July 25
B.J.

1108 posts
if the tag was made properly I assume you would have made a verbal out call .. the same should be done after the fielder attempted the bad tag and then threw the ball .. a loud verbal safe call should be made just like if it was a play at a base .. the adding of a no tag is a good idea just to let the defense and offense know why you called the runner safe.. just as in a play at a base where the ball beats the runner but the fielder is pulled off the bag .. call the runner safe with a explanation that the fielder was off the bag.. this "USUALLY" stops the defense from pissing and moaning.. lol
July 26
Bigtimer40

16 posts
The reason I didn't call him safe,was at that point he was middle between the bases, I wouldn't of had him safe until he was on the bag in front of him or behind if available. I agree that a "no tag" call in that scenario would have been acceptable.
July 26
B.J.

1108 posts
bigtimer.. I understand he wasn't on the bag .. but when a tag is being attempted on a runner and is missed or not done correctly there should be a safe call made just because of the attempt.. this lets both the offense and defense know that the attempted tag failed

July 26
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
1438 posts
B.J., my phone melted down or would talk with you on this. I was always taught not to give clues in clinics. For instance totally different situation, missing the plate or 1B. This year I have already had 2 young guys coming home Do I have to touch the plate? I will tell them after No, because is an appeal play. I always on a play like the example give the physical signal, and if they walk in the dugout to create their own out signal out but not verbalize. Rarely does anyone ever notice. The guy that taught me probably would have said You’re out and stupid. He taught me a lot…on what not to do. I am a big believer in umpires not getting themselves in bigger trouble. You know that you have my total respect.
July 26
B.J.

1108 posts
hi Nancy no problem WOW that's a lot of talking to melt your phone..lol

I believe anywhere on the field that when the defense attempts to get an out on a runner a safe or out call should be made

as far as a runner missing 1st base or home .. the rule states that a runner is always presumed to have touched a base.. so yes I would give both a verbal and safe call signal if the runner beat a throw to 1st or the plate and then wait to see if the defense makes an appeal .. not making a call would definitely be a clue for the defense that the runner missed the bag



July 27
Nancy Allen
Men's 55
1438 posts
B.J., maybe texting and internet now. You know that you have my utmost respect. I never make the verbal, only the physical on things like that. They want to call themselves out, is on them on my field. Those who know me on the field know am pretty loud anyway. So when I do mess up, well…
July 27
stick8

1992 posts
Like BJ, I would also verbalize a safe or out call on the described play. Another thing I would look for is the runner going out of the baseline. It doesn’t take much to do that.
Aug. 2
curty
Men's 60
187 posts
i do not call runners safe as they pass a base, nor do i call a close fair / foul ball fair verbally. I would use a "safe" gesture in this scenario. I call an out when it occurs, and the defense (players) should know this by now. I think a non out call should signal to ALL involved that there was no tag. In this scenario it is not the umpires position to tell the defense or offense anything, as an out did not occur. I don't tell the defense when a runner misses a base and make no call on the initial play, so why would I help them in this case.
Aug. 2
B.J.

1108 posts
curty.. by you not making a verbal safe call on a runner who misses first base but beats the throw definitely would tell the defense that something is wrong .. the rule book states that a runner is always assumed to have touched a bag they have passed .. so if he beats the throw a verbal safe call should be made .. now it’s up to the defense to appeal if they think he missed the bag…
the reason I give a verbal safe no tag call is because the defense actually made an attempt to make an out and my job as an umpire is to either give a verbal safe or out call because most of the time the runner and the defender are not in position to actually see a non-verbal safe signal that you are making
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